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Question
Posted by: David | 2010-05-26

re ongoing therapy

Every few days I have a good read through this forum and CS? Did you have a bad experience with traditional therapy? Your slating of it along with your heavy promotion of CBT makes one wonder...
As a fellow shrink, I really think you ought to take a broader view of your customers or they might improve fast but then they''ll be back a year or two later. maybe that''s what you''re after!

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Our expert says:
Expert ImageCyberShrink

I don't understand your point. There is much good scientific evidence for effectiveness of CBT, showing LASTING benefits, at least comparable to the benefits of the commonly used drugs, and with relatively brief therapy. I haven't been able to find anything like comparable evidence that any other form of therapy has comparable benefits. But I'd be delighted to look at such evidence if you'd care to provide it.
<br/>Now I'm bothered by your use of weasel words when you refer to "traditional therapy" - what on earth is that ? I suspect you are referring to psychoanalysis and related therapies, which are by no means "traditional", and are understandably not used by the vast majority of properly trained psychiatrists and psychologists. After so many decades, there is still no good evidence that analytic methods work, and as usually practised they take forever, and cost a fortune as well

Unlike analysts, who behave more like members of a religious cult than scientists, I am unable to recommend useless therapies. And when I hear of someone with symptoms that could probably be cleared up in months by modern methods, who has spent many years in analysis, it makes me honorably angry.

I have had no personal bad experiences with such therapies, but have helped so many refugees from such therapy who have had so many bad experiences with it, that I have formed my views based on science, on clinical experience, and on applying academic standards to the literature of those fields.

And when you say, somewhat patronizingly, "As a fellow shrink, I really think you ought to take a broader view of your customers or they might improve fast but then they'll be back a year or two later. maybe that's what you''re after! "

You are at it again, and cynical to boot. There is absolutely no evidence whatever that analysis ( which must be what you're referring to, as its the only method I regularly slate other than hypnosis when given as sole therapy by people who are not qualified shrinks ) has ANY lasting benefits.

One really has to distinguish between the CLAIMS made by a therapist, and what good quality research can actually demonstrate. I am most exactly NOT after recommending methods which will lead people either into everlasting therapy, or repeated returns for patching up therapy.

And what is in the faintest sense "broader" about psychoanalysis than CBT or similar forms of modern therapy ?

And sadly, D sounds like she is still speaking like a cult member, devoted to a method that has demonstrably failed her.

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5
Our users say:
Posted by: another fellow shrink | 2010-05-27

I think what has to be understood here, before all thinking becomes totally black/white, is that just because therapy is not strictly CBT does not make it psychoanalysis, nor indeed useless for that matter. Telling a patient that she is an analyst just because she disagrees/argues with one seems a bit fatuous and indeed extreme.

Reply to another fellow shrink
Posted by: Anon | 2010-05-27

Well, poor CS! Honestly, I too have read through and can say, as a long-time sufferer of depression (and have therefore been through the gamut of different therapies) find Cybershrink to be one of the best experts on this forum. He gives well thought-out advice and seems to actually care about the people making the posts. Personally, I''ve had FAR better experiences with CBT and have found psychoanalysis to be costly and pointless: DO I really have time to waffle on about a dream for 5 sessions? No. Nor do I have the money. So, I think CS is definitely justified in making the recommendations he does. Maybe you should get ablog, David, and expound your own theories on it.

Cybershrink: you are doing a great job and I say: well done!

Reply to Anon
Posted by: Overbalanced. | 2010-05-26

CS. You need to do something about that giant chip on your shoulder, it is beginning to give itself away.

Reply to Overbalanced.
Posted by: D | 2010-05-26

What I don''t understand is that when I wrote in as a layperson having been traumatised by a depth therapy experience (that - I dared to argue - had not much to do with the methodology but more to do with the inexperience and countertransference feelings of a therapist) - I get told that I have been brainwashed by the " psychoanalytic cult" , that I myself am an analyst and that my therapist is a predator and rapist (the-rapist)! This after I had explained that I had a background of CSA. Perhaps the acronym needed to be expounded - Childhood Sexual Abuse. I cannot begin to explain to you what that reply did to me.

Reply to D
Posted by: cybershrink | 2010-05-26

I don't understand your point. There is much good scientific evidence for effectiveness of CBT, showing LASTING benefits, at least comparable to the benefits of the commonly used drugs, and with relatively brief therapy. I haven't been able to find anything like comparable evidence that any other form of therapy has comparable benefits. But I'd be delighted to look at such evidence if you'd care to provide it.
<br/>Now I'm bothered by your use of weasel words when you refer to "traditional therapy" - what on earth is that ? I suspect you are referring to psychoanalysis and related therapies, which are by no means "traditional", and are understandably not used by the vast majority of properly trained psychiatrists and psychologists. After so many decades, there is still no good evidence that analytic methods work, and as usually practised they take forever, and cost a fortune as well

Unlike analysts, who behave more like members of a religious cult than scientists, I am unable to recommend useless therapies. And when I hear of someone with symptoms that could probably be cleared up in months by modern methods, who has spent many years in analysis, it makes me honorably angry.

I have had no personal bad experiences with such therapies, but have helped so many refugees from such therapy who have had so many bad experiences with it, that I have formed my views based on science, on clinical experience, and on applying academic standards to the literature of those fields.

And when you say, somewhat patronizingly, "As a fellow shrink, I really think you ought to take a broader view of your customers or they might improve fast but then they'll be back a year or two later. maybe that's what you''re after! "

You are at it again, and cynical to boot. There is absolutely no evidence whatever that analysis ( which must be what you're referring to, as its the only method I regularly slate other than hypnosis when given as sole therapy by people who are not qualified shrinks ) has ANY lasting benefits.

One really has to distinguish between the CLAIMS made by a therapist, and what good quality research can actually demonstrate. I am most exactly NOT after recommending methods which will lead people either into everlasting therapy, or repeated returns for patching up therapy.

And what is in the faintest sense "broader" about psychoanalysis than CBT or similar forms of modern therapy ?

And sadly, D sounds like she is still speaking like a cult member, devoted to a method that has demonstrably failed her.

Reply to cybershrink

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